Nature of Spiritual Reality: Questions to Kyle Griffith on the Meaning of “The War in Heaven”

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Questions and Answers

 
Can you explain more clearly the differences between Elementals, animalistic Elementals, "young" Gods, "mature" Gods and of course "free and autonomous minds"?

The first four are what I call "collective astral entities", made up of a group of astral souls linked together with strands of astral matter that conduct astral energy as a metal wire conducts electricity.
 
Studied by itself, each of these astral souls is structure of living astral matter very similar to one of the independent astral entities your question calls "free and autonomous minds" and WiH (War in Heaven) calls "Free Spirits".

Any astral soul, whether independent or part of a collective entity, can also be called an "astral body", and possess its own astral mind and personality structure.

In order to make a reasonably coherent comparison of the different types of collective astral entities, I have to begin by describing the simplest form that these entities take, which you didn't include in your question:


"Theocratic Bands".
 
These are groups of linked spirits that can range in size from two or three individuals up to hundreds.

In most cases, one of these spirits is Dominant Theocrat ­ the spirit whose astral mind controls and dominates the astral minds of the other spirits in the Band by sending energy impulses along the strands that bind the members of the Band together.

However, the degree of autonomy possessed by the minds of subordinate spirits in a Theocratic Band varies considerably.

Some have almost none and are for all practical purposes "mindless slaves".
 
Others are "Subordinate Theocrats" with a degree of autonomy as long as they enjoy the Dominant Theocrat's favor.

In some large Theocratic Bands, the original Theocrat becomes insane or senile and is replaced by a "junta" of several Subordinate Theocrats.

This is usually temporary, and one of the Subordinates usually takes power and either drives out the other Subordinates, or totally enslaves them.

The astral minds of all of the spirits in a Theocratic Band deteriorate at a slow but steady pace.

Eventually, the Dominant Theocrat goes senile or insane and there is no Subordinate Theocrat in the Band who is still in a good enough mental condition to take over.

At this point, the Band becomes an Elemental.

Large Elemental Bands usually hang around places where large religious rituals used to be held but are no longer used for this purpose.

Small Elemental Bands are often found in "haunted houses".

However, Elementals are free to move around, and actually can turn up almost anywhere.

The difference between "ordinary" and "animalistic" Elementals is one of degree, not of kind. 

Ordinary Elementals often communicate with the living telepathically using recognizable verbal and visual images, though they still appear obviously delusional and irrational.
 
Animalistic Elementals are less sane than this, and usually just project raw emotion with little content that stimulates a response from the intellect of the living recipient of their telepathic messages.

Gods are something entirely different.
 
They are composed of what WiH calls "Elohim Spirits", which have astral souls somewhat different from those of any of the spirits just described.
 

The chief differences are:


  1. They have astral minds which can link together into a group mind that is a "whole that is greater than the sum of its parts". In other words, a collective that is not just one mind dominating others, but autonomous individual minds working in concert voluntarily.
  2. The astral minds of Elohim Spirits don't deteriorate if they link their astral bodies to other astral souls; in fact, they deteriorate if such linkages don't occur.

As far as I know, the only difference between "young" Gods and "mature" Gods is the number of Elohim spirits involved and the degree to which they have learned to function in unison as part of a group mind.

However, according to WiH, the Gods contain ordinary human spirits as well as Elohim spirits.

Supposedly, the Elohim spirits take good care of them and are able to prevent their astral minds from deteriorating.
 
The Elohim say such ordinary human spirits have to be included if new Gods are to be created on a planet like Earth, because these are the kind of astral souls spontaneously generated by earthly physical bodies if an existing soul does not incarnate in an infant.

In other words, the Elohim can incarnate on Earth and can live indefinitely on its astral plane in a disembodied state, but they can't reproduce here.

Since a God has to contain millions of individual astral bodies, and there are not that many Elohim spirits on Earth, (I have no idea of the number), ordinary souls have to be included.
 
I believe the Elohim when they explain why they include ordinary astral souls in the Gods, but I've always had serious doubt about how well these souls are treated over long periods of time.

Here is some new information that isn't in WiH:


My guess, and it's only a guess, is that during the Last Days, the Elohim are going to round up all the astral souls trapped in Theocratic Bands and Elemental Bands, erase most of the contents of their astral minds, and use them as "building material" in the new Gods.

They will then invite Free Spirits that they think are suitable for the job to volunteer as "colonists" ­ astral souls whose memories and conscience will remain intact until they reincarnate on some distant world.
 
(I certainly won't volunteer.

If my soul can "slip through a wormhole" or something and reincarnate on some distant world with an advanced civilization right away, I'll consider it.

Otherwise, I'll stay and accept my fate as an ordinary Earth Person.

The idea of riding one of those Gods for millions of years makes my skin crawl.)

This answer is a guess, because I've never been able to get a straight answer on this from the Elohim spirits, and the "Space People" can't tell me either, because of treaties.

When some free minds regroup, can they do something else, another kind of structure than "God" or "Elemental"?

In this structure, are the memories and the conscience of each mind still preserved?

Both the Elohim spirits and the Free Spirits have always assured me that no other kind of structure is possible.

I've always found this difficult to believe, but there's no way I can channel further information on the subject.
 
For this reason, the subject of "other collective astral entities" is an area where information from sources other than my Spirit Guides is going to be very important to the present WiH Project.

Do our survival reflexes and our egocentrism serve as kind of tool or asset to help us maintain our mind as a autonomous structure?

My Spirit Guides tell me to say "No, but…" on this.
 
To elaborate, survival reflexes are programs in the subconscious mind that are triggered by traumatic events and motivate us to take instant action to deal with the emergency,

"Before we have time to think."

Some may be programmed into us genetically, others are learned from experience during the present lifetime, and still others may be past-life memories.

Whatever the origin of their survival reflexes, very few people have the specialized ones needed to avoid Theocratic entrapment on the Astral Plane when they Pass Over.
 
My own past life memories contain such reflexes, as was evident in my OBEs, but I'm a very unusual person.

And egocentrism actually decreases a person's chances of avoiding Theocratic entrapment.

The egocentric person is especially prone to manipulation by flattery, and the Theocrats are masters of that.

On the other hand, it is quite possible to program yourself during life with survival reflexes that will allow you to increase your chances of avoiding Theocratic entrapment after death.
 

WiH describes some of these quite plainly:


instinctively shy away from other spirits and think,

"Talk, but don't touch",

is one.

"Think carefully before you do anything",

is another.

"Search your astral subconscious mind for programs that will help you use telepathy and other psychic powers actively"

The instructions in WiH are less clear on how to do this.
 
Many different systems of occultism and spiritual practice can teach these skills, and since variations in individual personality structures require different systems, the book can't recommend any particular ones.

People just have to shop around until they find a system that works for them.
 
The process is not easy, but it is possible.

The same applies to egocentrism.

It is bad in itself, but strengthening the conscious will, increasing one's moral courage and integrity, etc. is a good idea.

Doing this may appear to an outside observer to also increase egocentrism, but this is an illusion.
 
These skills can usually be learned through the same system a given individual uses to learn survival reflexes that will be useful on the Other Side.
 
Does an Elemental have a will or a conscience?

Are they all dangerous or are some of them are benevolent ?

An ordinary Elemental has some conscious will, but not as much as an ordinary, sane person.

An animalistic Elemental has little of either.

Both devote most of their energy to going around devouring any weak disembodied souls that don't have the sense to run from them.
 
They are all dangerous, and if some appear benevolent, it is a ruse to get living people to either make human or animal sacrifices to them, or as the least, to allow the Elemental to such energy from their astral soul.
 
The IC's (Invisible College) advice is to avoid them completely, both on the Earth Plane and on the Astral Plane after you pass over.
 
When a spirit is taken into a young God, what does it lose?

When it is taken into an old God, does it lose something different?

And what is given in exchange?

I think I covered this in my answer to Question 1.

 
If a soul is eaten by an elemental, does this mean that its mind loses everything ­ memories, conscience, autonomy?

Does it just wither away and die as its energy flows into the Elemental?

Yes, I'm afraid this true.

And this can happen quite quickly, not over a period of many years, as often happens to a soul trapped in an ordinary Theocratic Band.
 
All I can do is repeat what my Spirit Guides have told me so many times ­ stay away from them.

In the Last Days scenario, it seems that the only escape is reincarnation.

Why?

And where?

On earth again?

To answer your last question first ­ right now, the Invisible College (IC) has no definitive answer to this question.
 
Nobody knows when the Last Days will arrive or how much damage will be done to the Earth's ecosystem in the process.

The human race may end up having to live permanently in space colonies if it survives at all.

Or people may be able to live on Earth, but only underground or under domes.
 
No one know how large a population any of these scenarios will sustain, how much of our present knowledge and technology will survive, or how human civilization will evolve from that point.

Your first question is one that many people keep asking over and over, because nobody likes the IC's answer, which is repeated many times in WiH (War in Heaven).

Yes, the only escape is reincarnation.
 
If there are "Higher Planes" the IC spirits don't know any more about them than we do.

Well, there's that "astral souls creeping through wormholes" idea, but the IC doesn't talk much about it.
 
I think it's pretty rare, and talking about it tends to make people more prone to theocratic deception.

I read some material saying that reincarnation on earth is a trap and an illusion.

We are caught in a web of pain and deception, forced to submit to the power of entities and paternalistic theocracies.

Is this idea true?

Considering what life on Earth is like, do you really think that a system of endless reincarnation is a good thing?

One of the most important points in WiH is that reincarnation can be empirically proven if one conducts the research properly, and in fact, books describing such proofs have already been published.

Some of them are listed in the WiH Bibliography, and many better ones have been published since.

Neither I nor my Spirit Guides ever said that,

"endless reincarnation is a good thing".

The whole idea is that anyone who says something simplistic like that is trying to fool you.
 
The reality is that the Astral Plane has just as much pain, deception, paternalism, etc. as the Earth Plane.

However, Earthly life has plenty of good aspects to balance out the bad aspects, especially if you work hard to maximum the good and minimize the bad.
 
A soul trapped in a Theocratic band, experiences little of the good and has even less chance of improving its lot through its own efforts than a person in an earthly prison has.

What really and deeply happens to a mind immersed in a Theocratic Band after the so-called "death"?

I seem to remember that there's more material on this in the description of "Theocratic Bands" in the 1988 WiH than Gerry Zeitlin included in his summary for the Notes.
 
It's the kind of heart-wrenching emotionalism that I try to keep to a minimum, but there are areas where it is necessary to put it in.

Here are a few details that will give you a general idea.

Many Christians eagerly join a Theocratic Band believing they are entering Heaven.

And they can perceive what seem to be "golden streets" except that they all seem to lead back to the same room, where there's a dull church service going on.

It's being conducted by a very authoritarian preacher who spouts a lot of apparent nonsense, and the congregation is expected to greet every pause with enthusiastic "Amens".

If someone asks,

"When can I meet Jesus?"

the answer is,

"You aren't ready for that yet."

And a lot of the other worshippers seem to be babbling idiots or raving lunatics.

But the trapped soul can't escape ­ those streets always lead back to the same room.

After a while, the person begins to realize,

"This is really Hell",

but tries to fights those thoughts off, knowing that,

"This way lies madness."

Slowly, he or she does become more and more despondent and delusional, and experiences an ever-increasing lethargy as well.

When you talk about low and high stages of development, what do you mean?

When you say that a person is in a low stage of development, are you referring to someone who completely mind controlled and submits to a religion to the point of being essentially without free will?

What are the criteria that determine whether we are low or high in maturity?

Well, the reality sounds quite elitist to anyone with a "modern, progressive" viewpoint.

It's one of those aspects of the WiH information that,

"I wish wasn't true but have to admit that it is."

The human astral soul evolves slowly over the course of many lives, if the person is able to evade Theocratic entrapment and keep reincarnating.
 
People who make a deliberate effort to gain access to their subconscious mind and make use of the programs they find there ­ such as the ones used in practicing telepathy ­ make more progress along this line of evolution that people who don't.

Having spontaneous flashes of past-life memory is a sign that someone is at a higher than average state of development.
 
As Krishna tells Arjuna in the Bhagavad Gita,

"We have both lived many lives.

The only difference is, I remember mine and you don't remember yours."
 
This kind of elitist thinking was one of the factors that created the infamous Hindu Caste System, but there's still a kernel of truth behind it.

And yes, what WiH calls a "New Soul" ­ a person whose astral soul was created during the present lifetime because the soul of a deceased person didn't incarnate in the body during infancy ­usually has less free will, creative intelligence, etc. than one of the "Twice Born".
 
Such people almost never learn enough psychic skills during earthly life to reincarnate without help from the IC after they pass over.

This is complicated by the fact that such people are also especially prone to give in to Theocratic mind control during physical life ­ they have neither the will nor the skills to resist.
 

This is a reason why Theocratic religions have always promoted population growth:


it gives them a steady supply of New Souls to feed on.

What can you tell me about the souls of animals and plants?

Our domestic animals for instance?

Where do they come from and what role do they play in the War in Heaven?

This is mentioned briefly in WiH, but in a way that discourages readers from thinking too much about the matter.
 
Animals and plants do have astral souls, and these aren't necessarily "primitive" by our standards ­ they are just "different".

The astral genome of each species is different from that of every other species, and all are different enough from the human genome that human/animal reincarnation is not possible.
 
Animal sacrifices do produce "food" for Theocrats, but it is "nutritionally inferior" and they much prefer human sacrifices.

During the channeling of WiH in the Eighties, when I pressed my Spirit Guides for further information on this topic, I was always brushed off with statements such as,

"This is beyond the scope of our present mission, which is to help human beings learn more about the nature of their particular spiritual reality."

Since then, I have channeled a little more information on this subject, but it is still sketchy.

Here's a sample:


Other species live in other realities, but speculation about this is often used by the Theocrats as a distraction to divert serious seekers of spiritual knowledge from becoming aware of their existence and learning to resist their mind-control techniques.

I'm content with this ­ my limited human intelligence has enough trouble just understanding and communicating the WiH information.

According to the Gnostic "faith", a kind of plan was developed to impose a paternalistic theocracy on Earth based on the belief in salvation.

This plan is based on the assumption that "God is Perfect, humans are not", and that we must obey and submit in order to be "saved".

The Gnostics believe that this devious plan was of alien origin, brought to Earth by a demiurge creature, the Archon and that it spreads from person to person like an infection.

What do you think about it?

If I didn't know any more about Gnosticism than the brief sketch you give in your questions, I'd say,

"This sounds very much like a rephrasing of some of the most essential ideas in WiH."

However, the reality, as I've seen it over the course of my life, is much more complicated.
 
There are many different groups, each claiming "We are the True Gnostic Faith".

I agree with the doctrines of some much more than I agree with the doctrines of others.

For example, "Gnostica Magazine" was one of the few wide-circulation publications that gave the 1988 WiH a serious review.

It wasn't a rave review, by any means, but it wasn't just a dismissal of the ideas either.

The reviewer made one statement that instantly impressed me as being really favorable, but he then went on to make it clear that it really didn't impress him that way.

As I recall the statement after seventeen years, it went something like,

"The theories in WiH are just materialistic humanism carried one step higher, to include reincarnation, and psychic powers."

This struck as so apt that I quoted it out of context to promote the book.

By itself, it's an excellent nut-shell summary of some of the most essential ideas in WiH (War in Heaven).

However, the editor of the magazine later told me in private correspondence that,

"Personally, I prefer to believe in a God who transcends the concepts described in your book."

Our correspondence just withered away after that.

Looking back, I think the people who reviewed WiH were what one might call "conservative" Gnostics, and the people who wrote the material you are quoting might be called "radical" Gnostics.

Of course, I'd be surprised if people in either group would like to be labeled like that.

I do know that many different works that are considered traditional Gnostic literature have considerable amounts of WiH information embedded in them.
 
Right now, it looks to me like "radical" Gnostics have a role to play in the IC's present major effort to make these ideas public, but I don't yet know how it relates to the role I'm playing.
 
I'll just have to wait and see.

According to the Gnostics, again, our true resources come from the Earth, from Nature, from an intelligence that incarnates in the planet itself.

What do you think about that?

When I worked on the previous WiH Project back in the Eighties and Nineties, my opinion on this was the same as my opinion on animals having souls that I discussed previously.
 

Roughly, it was:


"There's a lot of important truth to be learned by studying this subject, but it's not directly applicable to the ‘main mission', and it has been used as a Theocratic distraction mechanism to an even greater extent.

"It appears self-evident to me that the idea of the Earth as a sentient, spiritual being and the idea that animals and plants have souls that survive death and undergo evolution are part of the same general concept.
 
However, I'm still limiting the scope of my inquiries, and I also have to point out that it's very easy for people to leap from the idea of an "Intelligent Planet" to a "Great Mother Goddess" who seems to behave just as tyrannically as the "God the Father Almighty" of the Judeo-Christian religions."

 
Now that I'm working on the current WiH project and people who call themselves Gnostics are circulating very similar ideas, embedded in a slightly different "myth" or worldview, I may have to rethink some of this.

In any case, your questions point out some of the apparent differences in the two "myths" very well.
 
My snap judgment on the matter right now is that points of agreement are major, and the points of disagreement are just details that may even prove illusory when closely examined.

When a "non-religious" person dies, what are the chances that he or she will be able to avoid be entrapped by Elementals or Theocratic Bands?

And what happens if a person who avoids Theocratic entrapment doesn't want to be involved in reincarnation or connected to a God, either?

Well, I say in WiH that non-believers have an advantage over believers in avoiding Theocratic entrapment after they Pass Over.
 
And I say that some astral souls at a low stage of spiritual development avoid Theocratic entrapment by accident and just wander aimlessly on the Astral Plane until they wither away from "starvation".
 
I call such people "Lost Souls".

The same would apply to more advanced souls who recognize the Theocrats for what they are but are looking for "something better" if they kept looking indefinitely, but this is very rare.

The vast majority eventually decide to reincarnate even though they find the idea of another go-round in this "vale of tears" to be repugnant.

The chance to be involved in the creation of a God may eventually give a lot of them an "easy way out" of this dilemma, though I still have my personal doubts about the wisdom of doing this, as I stated earlier.
 
In any case, that opportunity isn't presently available, and may not happen on a wide scale during the lifetimes of most of the people who read what I'm writing here.

My next question is about the entropy of the mind.

It seems, according to the material contained in WiH, that the mind is subject to entropy:


it will age, become senile, and could eventually wither away and disappear completely unless it goes into another incarnation or is connected with a God.

What is the nature of this death?

Does the mind really disappear or is it possible that it goes to another place, another astral plane unknown to the IC?

First of all, it is necessary to make a clear distinction between the astral mind and the astral soul, just as it is made one between the physical mind and the physical body.
 
Both the physical body and the astral soul contain neural tissue that acts as a "biocomputer".

The mind is simply a name for the data stored in that computer and the software used for processing that data.

This means that the mind is not directly subject to entropy, but the hardware it is stored in can certainly deteriorate or be completely destroyed.

And the astral mind goes where the astral soul goes, just as the physical mind goes where the physical body goes.

I already said in my answer to an earlier question that there may very well be "another plane" that the spirits I am in contact with don't know about.
 
However, the WiH ideas in general make it obvious that the information on this subject that I have been able to obtain from other sources, such as religious literature, can be explained away as Theocratic deceptions.
 
I can't directly prove this, of course, but it's the best conclusion I can draw from the available evidence.

There is plenty of evidence to support reincarnation, survival of the soul on the astral plane between lives, and telepathic communication between living people and disembodied spirits.
 
On the other hand, most of the claims about "supernatural beings" and "eternal life in Heaven or hell" can either be explained in terms of the three things I just mentioned, or they can't be supported with evidence at all.

Are the human soul and disembodied spirits on the astral plane subject to entropy?

If so, what is the nature of this entropy?

Entropy on the astral plane is exactly the same as entropy on the physical plane. Complex things tend to break down into simpler things.
 
The astral body needs nourishment to survive just as the physical body does, and it also tends to deteriorate with age just as the physical body does.

We must admit logically that our eternal and infinite Universe, "the Great All and Everything" must have a source of creation ­ not a beginning but a source, a transcendental one.

Does the IC have information about this all-knowing and infinite source that I supposed could be the God of all gods?

It's never been self-evident to me that the existence of the universe is evidence that it has a "source".

There's evidence that it has "evolved over time", but time also is part of the universe.
 
I'm quite willing to admit that I simply don't know, and my Spirit Guides have always told me they feel the same.

Some authors speculate that human minds are controlled by reptilian entities.

The symbolism of reptile and snake is quite important in our history.

Does it have a meaning for you and for the IC?

Well, the snake is mentioned in WiH as being a symbol of reincarnation in many mythologies, because it sheds its skin periodically.

The reptile crawls away looking younger, and the cast-off skin often resembles a dead snake.

I've channeled the information several times over the years that some of the extraterrestrial spirits who now incarnate on Earth once inhabited reptilian bodies on other worlds.

However, my Guides have made it clear to me that telepathic contact with such spirits is not the source of most of the visions of reptilian monsters that people have had throughout history.
 
The actual explanation is that sane spirits usually transmit "normal" images of themselves when they communicate with people telepathically, and insane spirits often transmit ugly or frightening images.
 
I once asked for clarification of this from my Guides and received a fleeting image of an actual "lizard man".
 
He looked like a small dinosaur with hands, but the eyes looked almost like human eyes ­familiar rather than frightening.

I've received many images of "monsters", everything from Whitley Streiber's "grays" to Richard Shaver's "deros", and most of them seemed to be the same kind of distortions of the human image that are common in schizophrenic delusions.
 

SAUCE: